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by Michael Wittmer
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1. This isn't an article about Anne Rice, it starts out that way, but then you make an example of enlightenment individualism. You don't actually deal with Rice's issue, but instead critique a category you yourself put her in.

2. I think it a real shame that you so closely link the words "Christianity" and the Church. Anne Rice is quiting "Christianity", and how that will effect her involvment with the body of Christ, the Church is yet to be seen. I hope you would give her the grace to make the decision.

Sad to see that Anne is being used as a platform.

Youtharerevolting:

I think that Anne's issue is Enlightenment individualism, which she is one more example of. So I believe it does deal specifically with her issue.

Anne herself equates leaving Christianity with leaving the church. That's actually her point. So I disagree with you here.

Yes, indeed if we read her words we can see that it is very unclear on a Christian theological level. But the Church is both visible and invisible, and she appears to have had it with the Church Visible, at least the Roman. Since I too was born & raised Irish Roman Catholic in Dublin in the 50's and early 60's. I know something of her deep frustration with the R. Catholic Church. But as Pope John Paul II said, "The mystery of the Church", its "invisible dimensions",is "larger than the structure and organization of the Church",which are "at the service of the mystery."

I am myself a "Churchman", but Christ is always 'the Church' in Himself, visible (incarnate) & invisible (still Incarnate)! Even now "He put everything under His feet..."the fulness of the One who fills all things in every way." (Eph.1:22-23)

Fr. Robert:

Thank you for your insights. Karl Barth said that those who wanted to belong to the invisible church without being a member of the visible church were guilty of ecclesiastical docetism. He said that we can't say "credo ecclesiam" if we don't believe in our specific, concrete, visible church.

Hi Dr. Wittmer,

Not to defend Rice - I've never read her writings and know little about her - but it seems to me that you do her a disservice by boiling down her reasoning to homosexuality, and then dissecting that in terms of individualism, and coming to a (provisional) conclusion that she never really was saved.

I think it's worthwhile to read what she actually wrote. Can any sincere Christian deny that the Church is "quarrelsome, hostile, [and] disputatious"? And regarding the "refuse to be" list she gave: it seems to me that what she is saying is that the Church world has imposed on its members a variety of implied social and political positions that a "good" Christian ought to take. You write that "the church has supported science and includes many members who are Democrats," but ignore the flagrant hostility that conservative Christians often have toward those who lean to the left in politics or agree with widespread scientific conclusions regarding the age of the earth or the threat of climate change. And if we would allow some of these nonessentials to remain nonessentials, perhaps people like Rice could have the emotional and intellectual space to grapple with actual issues, like homosexuality, to which the Bible does speak clearly.

Here's my point: if we impose upon believers a litmus test of social opinions and political positions that Scripture does not impose, aren't we committing the Galatian heresy, erecting artificial roadblocks to faith that keep "Gentiles" (i.e., liberals) out?

Thank you, Michael, for a thoughtful post. I especially appreciate the concern you raise about projecting our own beliefs onto Jesus, making him in our image.

Keith:

I agree that we ought not to impose non-essential political or social views upon others. There is plenty of room in the church for Republicans and Democrats with differing opinions on lots of things. I agree with Anne here, though I disagree that the RCC is as anti-science and anti-Democrat as she claims.

I am simply taking her at her word that the RCC's opposition to gay marriage was the last straw for her and the final reason why she left the church. And in response I would say that the morality of homosexual practice is not a gray area where Christians have the biblical freedom to disagree. To support homosexual practice is to disagree with the Word of God.

I will let God judge whether or not she is saved, but according to Cyprian she has placed herself in a bad spot, for "Outside the church there is no salvation."

Mike,

That was a refreshing critique of the Enlightenment individualism that currently pervades our social thinking. I also expected some of the responses you received; nevertheless, "wisdom is justified by all her children"

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